Cylinder shimming question

I have my block set up to measure the gap for shimming the cylinder liner and found it to have a flush condition. From the various manuals I was expecting the liner to stand proud of the block. What is the normal condition for this, proud, subflush, flush? I would appreciate the help.

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Yep .normal .
How many notches on the liners .There are supposedly 3 different liners batches with 1,2 or 3 but I've only ever seen the 2 notch .Tolerance bands I assume from OE manufacture .
I've had some below deck, so much that they rattled even when clamped down .Double shimming is sometimes required and no problems .

[johnb]

If you don't already have a manual, these extracts from the Haynes manual might help.

I appreciate the straight to the point answer. What is driving me nuts is it looks to me like the shim is also the seal between the oil pan and water jacket. With that said I struggle with the thought of stacking shims to get the right height. So that is normal to do?


Martin:
No shims in the pic just a dry fit

Clee:
All my liners are II (2 marks)

John:
Yes per your recommendation I bought the manual and reviewed the specs but big kudos on scanning the pages and posting them - a true gentleman

I may be overthinking this one but the shim/seal thing seems like it could be easily buggered up so I am proceeding with caution.

Are you guys using paper or metal shims? Any pros or cons from experience?

[johnb]

From my amateur engine building experience (less than a dozen engines) all the Renault engines used 'paper' gaskets. I haven't had problems with them and assume that's the case for the thousands of engines built using this method.
I've never heard of steel shims in relation to Renault engines.

This is where I am coming from with the two materials:
http://dmctalk.org/showthread.php?4808- ... ome-advice
The metallic ones seem to make more sense to me. I agree the paper has been the standard but I am exploring all the options. Any thoughts?

[johnb]

OK, I wasn't aware of these metal shims. Maybe the engine builders on the forum might know more?

Typical..... And it is from an American DMC site too.

I've never used paper ones .
All mine are either plastic or metal .Metal on the later 3l with larger liner base location but mainly I use the plastic ones .These are all OE Ren bits .
Touch wood I've never had any issues with doubling up either .My main problem always comes from rotted out liner locations in the block .Get these sorted and it's all good but you must get as close to top limit protrusion if at all poss .

[johnb]

Do the plastic ones look like paper? First photo below are Renault liner gaskets for the A110 engine. Second photo is one of these torn which shows a fibrous texture. Would you call these plastic or paper?

I'd call those paper .
The plastics ones are transparent in green ,red and yellow .Like a sweet wrapper but a lot stiffer .
I'll take a pic to illustrate .

[stephendell]

Like Clee I have only seen plastic ones from Renault for the last few years.

Those you have are new old stock paper.

[johnb]

Something new to learn every day, thanks for the information.